85 — Trauma Bonds, Healing, and Rebuilding with Dr. Nadine Macaluso
Narcissists and psychopaths are just a few examples of “pathological lovers.” Their charm often lures people in and their partners often develop what’s known as “trauma bonds.” They’re tough to escape, but once you do, the healing can begin.
No one knows this better than Dr. Nadine Macaluso. She was married to the man known as “The Wolf of Wall Street.” After years of abuse, she broke free from the trauma bond and became a therapist so she could help other people. Some of the things she shares today are how to recognize red flags in relationships, how to break free from a trauma bond, and how to begin healing.
About Dr. Nadine Macaluso
Dr. Nadine Macaluso is a licensed marriage and family therapist with a deeply personal insight into the world of unhealthy relationships. She was once married to Jordan Belfort, infamously known as the Wolf of Wall Street, an experience that has significantly informed her professional journey. After enduring 14 years of a tumultuous relationship, Dr. Macaluso has turned adversity into advocacy, specializing in helping those entangled in trauma bonds and toxic relationships. As an author, she has penned the book “Run Like Hell,” drawing from both her personal history and her professional expertise in the field.
Key Takeaways:
- Recognizing Red Flags: The importance of understanding and identifying red flags in a relationship, such as entitlement, superiority, and manipulative behaviors.
- Pathological Lover Traits: An overview of what constitutes a pathological lover, including tendencies toward narcissism, psychopathy, Machiavellianism, and sadism.
- Defining Trauma Bonds: The role of intermittent reinforcement and power imbalances in creating toxic and emotionally damaging bonds between partners.
- Leaving Unhealthy Relationships: The complexities of leaving an abusive relationship and the value of education, self-care, and support systems in the healing process.
- Potential for Change: Insights into the possibility of change for individuals exhibiting toxic behavior patterns, depending on their background and willingness to amend their ways.
Notable Quotes:
- “It’s one thing to be kind and altruistic, but in the wrong hands, agreeableness gets weaponized.” – Dr. Nadine Macaluso
- “If somebody wants to change, they can change. But pathological people don’t want to change because they like the comforts that come with being manipulative.” – Dr. Nadine Macaluso
- “If somebody can’t hear you, they can’t love you.” – Dr. Nadine Macaluso
Timestamp | Summary |
0:00:00 | Introduction: Unhealthy relationships and red flags |
0:00:20 | Nadine’s personal experience with ignoring red flags |
0:01:16 | Trauma bond and coercive control in relationships |
0:03:20 | Nadine’s background and expertise in unhealthy relationships |
0:04:28 | Accuracy of the movie “The Wolf of Wall Street” |
0:05:01 | Definition of a narcissist and the traits of a pathological lover |
0:06:27 | The concept of a trauma bond in toxic relationships |
0:07:27 | How pathological lovers manipulate and draw people into relationships |
0:09:31 | Personality traits that make individuals susceptible to toxic relationships |
0:10:11 | Challenging the victim-blaming narrative |
0:11:41 | Ignoring red flags and rationalizing unhealthy behaviors |
0:12:13 | Nadine Maculuso discusses her experience with a trauma bond and coercive control |
0:13:01 | Nadine suggests asking friends in a trauma bond if they want to be helped, hurt, or held |
0:14:45 | Amy and Nadine discuss the importance of education and language in understanding trauma bonds |
0:15:22 | Nadine explains the challenges of leaving a trauma bond, including financial and emotional dependency |
0:18:26 | Nadine discusses the prevalence of male narcissists in trauma bonds, but acknowledges that it can happen in any gender |
0:19:26 | The healing process after leaving a trauma bond is discussed, including stabilizing with self-care and therapy |
0:20:53 | Positive intrusive flashbacks and the fear of entering another relationship are addressed |
0:22:18 | Nadine provides tips for preventing trauma bonding, including self-awareness and recognizing red flags |
0:23:45 | The importance of communication and respect in healthy relationships is highlighted |
0:24:12 | Green flags to look for in a healthy relationship |
0:25:04 | Red flag: a partner with a history of crazy exes |
0:26:39 | The impact of technology on modern relationships |
0:27:56 | Trusting your gut instincts in a relationship |
0:28:35 | Recognizing patterns of controlling or lying behavior |
0:29:24 | Seeking advice from a trusted friend or family member |
0:30:08 | The potential for pathological lovers to change |
0:31:20 | The influence of childhood experiences on pathological behavior |
0:32:56 | The commonality of toxic relationships |
0:34:29 | Nadine’s lack of control over the movie adaptation of her story |
0:35:29 | Nadine talks about her relationship with her ex-husband and their children |
0:36:06 | Nadine shares advice on co-parenting and maintaining a healthy relationship after divorce |
0:36:28 | Nadine encourages people in toxic relationships to face their fears and work on personal growth |
0:37:20 | Amy Morin thanks Nadine for sharing her story and having her book |
0:37:44 | Amy breaks down Nadine’s mental strength building strategies |
0:37:44 | Strategy 1: Be on the lookout for red flags in a toxic relationship |
0:38:44 | Strategy 2: Get help from someone outside the relationship for an objective perspective |
0:39:47 | Strategy 3: Practice self-care and prioritize mental health while healing |
0:41:13 | Amy concludes the episode and encourages listeners to leave a review and share the show |
Links & Resources
Visit Dr. Macaluso’s website – drnae.com
Follow Dr. Macaluso on Instagram – @therealdrnadine
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